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Ooh dear ...

Discussion in 'EverQuest II General Discussion' started by Tkia, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. Love these!

    Especially when you get answers like "Yes, the Internet is plugged in" or "Yes, the Internet is turned on." :p
     
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  2. Alarra

    Alarra Active Member

    "I have no mouse, but my clicker works"
     
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  3. splitpawthanos

    splitpawthanos New Member

    I'm Fangrim on OF, It took a lot of willpower not to type my response to her all in capitals with lots of !!!!. For me there are 4 annoying ones there,in this order for me 1 Raff 2 Benito 3 Wysperwind 4 Nazy. Sig used to be up there but she's much better now.
     
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  4. Mizgamer62

    Mizgamer62 Active Member

    I would like to feed Raff to Nagafen....but I prefer the dragon...sooo lol :p
     
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  5. RhodrisNZ

    RhodrisNZ Geographically Challenged

    Welcome, Fangrim!! *waves*
     
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  6. Zynt

    Zynt Active Member

    Well, you now officially have 38 sock puppet accounts on the OF. They come with being a member here. Congratulations.
     
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  7. Tkia

    Tkia Active Member

    I feel your pain. I was using a lot of restraint not to scream at her by the time I was several posts in.

    Whil's explanation of the scaling problems makes sense though. I've always been aware that they turn up periodically with max level toons but never had one on test to fully understand it. And it just never dawned on me that in fact there are 2 levels 110 so yeah, if you're geared for the lower one and game is tuned to the higher one I can imagine there will be issues. And it really demonstrates just how horribly gear dependant this game has become.

    None of which explains the reluctance of some people to just mentor down and get on with it! :rolleyes:
     
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  8. Mermut

    Mermut Well-Known Member

    One of the more recent brainstorms (only on test so far)
    Let's make it impossible to tell what is killing people! What could possibly go wrong with that?!?!
     
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  9. Feldon

    Feldon Administrator Staff Member

    I commented on how there was sometimes a fifty-fold power increase between one level 100 character and another level 100 character and how much of a mess this was. A consequence of player power growing logarithmically each year.

    The Shadow Odyssey was a level overlay on Rise of Kunark and so players had tons of complimentary level 80 content. Then things started to go off the rails with level 90, with Drunder completely sh*tcanning the previous year's Velious content. Now content gets scrapped just 6 months later.

    The irony of content burn rate being LOW under Kunark/TSO when the team had 35 people, and the content burn rate now being HIGH with a team half that size has not been lost on me.
     
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  10. Cindrax

    Cindrax Active Member

    Why? That is the only question that pops up in my head...Did they create a bug they didn't feel like fixing so they just said "fark it, let it be"?
     
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  11. Feldon

    Feldon Administrator Staff Member

    I love the replies about this Performance change. Now the server is going to have to calculate, on every attack, whether the player's health has been cut by more than 50%? Even more load. lol
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2020
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  12. Feldon

    Feldon Administrator Staff Member

    This is perfect.

    zelless-eq2.png
     
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  13. Zynt

    Zynt Active Member

    Will that fit in a sig? I hate to replace my current sig of, "Benito, what happened to make you this way," but this is perfect.

    Edit - Yes, yes it will.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2020
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  14. Clementine

    Clementine Active Member

    Honestly the itemization issue on TLE blows my mind. It's like the dev doing itemization doesn't understand what any of the stats do. I just don't get how something can be done so poorly and there's nothing, no improvement, no admission that they could've done better. Just complete silence about it. Obviously the only answer is that whoever is heading the EQ2 team either doesn't care or doesn't think good itemization is important. Or thinks TLE in general isn't important despite it requiring a sub to access.

    Also the developers should NEVER have moderation access. That's such a bad idea. That's what the PR people are for - Dreamweaver in this case.

    This company is just so frustrating.
     
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  15. Mermut

    Mermut Well-Known Member

    Caith is the itemization dev. He's stated that he hates itemization. He also refuses help with itemization when it's offered.
     
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  16. Glasscannon

    Glasscannon Member

    I'm not the most tech savvy person but I cannot understand the decisions they make under the guise of lag management.

    Let's review: for every single ability used, the game needs to

    (1) Add the player's ability modifier to the base damage, up to a cap (and the existence of a cap adds a layer to the calculation),
    (2) resolve the RNG of the spell's damage range (i.e. settling on a number between, say, 100 & 200,
    (3) add the player's potency to that damage value,
    (4) determine whether the hit is a critical hit and if so, which of the three types of critical it is,
    (5) add the player's critical hit multiplier times the multiplier of the 'critical hit type',
    (6) modify the calculated damage against any resistance that the monster may have,
    (7) further modify the calculated damage against 'combat mitigation,'
    (8) perform a resolve check to calculate any resolve penalties,
    (9) multiply the final number by the player's fervor score,
    (10) perform a doublecast calculation,
    (11) perform any follow-on calculations for abilities that may affect other abilities, such as procs, dots, or skill resets, and
    (12) add the generated hate (which itself is often modified) to a separate tracked list.

    This is for every single profession and ascension ability. In addition, the game must perform a similar calculation for auto-attacks which is itself perhaps a 7 or 8 step process.

    So, in a raid zone with 24 players casting an average of 25 skills per minute plus, say, 20 auto-attacks, the game is responsible for resolving around 1,000 10-step player calculations per minute. And note that these inputs are constantly changing, depending on a multitude of buffs and debuffs, as well as depending on the mitigation mechanics (both hidden and known) of that particular mob.

    It would seem to me that reducing lag starts with streamlining these calculations.

    In comparison, what is removing the logging of one type of attack going to do? What they are addressing is minuscule in comparison to what gets logged. I mean it seems analogous to going to an overflowing dam with a coffee cup and scooping out some water and thinking, 'that should do the trick!'

    It's the same as the prior to 'attempts' to address lag in the past couple years. One was to disable custom UIs which to my knowledge is a client side change and wouldn't affect the server whatsoever. The other was a change to one particular summoner spell, because apparently the two-step calculation (pet then player) of that particular spell is what really set the servers ablaze.

    In trying to understand actions that seemingly make no sense, I always start with the presumption that the decision-maker is a rational person who is acting in their best interest. Within that framework, the only conclusion that makes sense is that they just don't care. They know what the cause of the lag issues are - a crappy server that is burdened by enormously bloated calculations - but they can't or don't want to fix it. They're not spending more on upgrading the server, and streamlining the calculations would mean eliminating profit centers because the whole point is to get players to chase more stats. At the same time they understand that server lag negatively affects customer experience so they need to *appear* to be doing something about it, which is why we see these positively silly decisions.
     
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  17. Sweatypie

    Sweatypie Active Member

    Caith does it now. Well, his script bot does it and while its still bad, at the beginning it was super awful.

    Fyreflyte did items for the previous TLE servers and he had to do it everytime a new one opened up because caith or kander kept changing encounters with tiny tweaks depending on if the server had channelers or not. The guy had already been layed off Daybreak once, but they hired him back and then fired him again during the last TLE server because of a lack of ressources I assume.

    One time he was confused; "Why would a channeler want potency"? (It increases the health of the construct, one of the most important mechanics of the class) and he just couldn't understand it but by the end he complied and made it somewhat tolerable. Mind you, it was never perfect. The developers absolutely do not have a clue what stats do anymore or how much each stat weights up against each other. I know birds (adonilol) several times have talked to them about stat weights but they just dont understand it.

    As for items in EQ2. Apparently they are created in a super odd way. They are inside one big folder and they have to manually open every single one and from what fyreflyte said, he cant look at the item and see where it drops from, he can only see what quality it is, the level and class requirements. so it was super hard for him to fix items in a quick and reliable way. Thats why you get some super strong items from a random mob sometimes and the fabled raid gear is just super poop or with odd stats.

    Caith created a bot a year ago or so so they can just take level/tier and slap stats on them, but offensive and spell stats are all over the place and there does not seem tobe a clear direction for anything for the TLE server.
     
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  18. Fuli

    Fuli Well-Known Member


    Actually, if iirc, it was Fireflyte who built the itemization tool, then they laid him off after they started using it.

    I wonder why Caith stopped pasting 11 pages of his scripting output describing 0.67% changes to the basic stats on every piece of gear for that expansion...that sh*t was useful.....
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2020
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  19. Feldon

    Feldon Administrator Staff Member

    I suggested raiders or other high end players help with Itemization. Kander was absolutely scandalized. I had a vision of a French chef screaming at me "How could you possibly fathom the depths of creating something so monumental as itemization?"
     
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  20. Feldon

    Feldon Administrator Staff Member

    I *believe* Aeralik was building the itemization tool and it was supposed to be delivered in time for it to be used to create the typical generic dungeon loot for that expansion. Instead because the tool arrived so late, Fireflyte had to dedicate all his time manually creating the typical dungeon loot and raid trash drops and there wasn't really any time left over for him to hand-craft the desirable group and raid items that players really care about. Fireflyte's anguish at Fan Faire was palpable.
     
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